Arctic Mud

ArcticMUD => General Discussion => Topic started by: eddiex on July 01, 2013, 11:10:45 PM

Title: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: eddiex on July 01, 2013, 11:10:45 PM
Bored.

-Early in the wipe, it is still possible to effectively zone w/o bots if neutral clans band together and there is an efficient and skilled leader to facilitate these activities (although it is my opinion that it is not possible to effectively compete with multis/bots because of the body advantage it gives the offender).

-If the people who bot/multi really gave a bapt about the playerbase and not just their shinies, they would leave the people described above alone regardless of circumstance (i.e. loaded one of your decays, zoning with your enemy for ranks, etc.).

-People threaten to quit if they are associated with bots/multiiers so they can try to leverage immortals into playing by their rules. 

-People really quit when they have something better to be doing than mudding all day.

-For those of you who say there isn't any clan without multiing/botting, it's just because your clan has bots and multis

-I don't know if Hoss telling SoB to tone down their multiing/botting and other questionable activity meant for them to stop completely, but if he didn't mean for them to stop multiing/botting completely it's pretty lame that this is even a rule.

-I am glad that a severe punishment was handed down to a clan in violation of the rules (although i don't think there is a truly effective measure to stop botting/multiing).
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: sam on July 02, 2013, 03:22:57 AM
"-People really quit when they have something better to be doing than mudding all day."

This!
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Jozheg on July 02, 2013, 08:37:18 AM
There's no problem with punishment, there's a problem with justice. If one would apply a saying "..and justice for all", the latter part has been omitted during the execution of this thesis, thus turning it rather into a repressive outbreak, than a rule enforcement.
I'm actually referring not only to our incident, but to the one of dele's, as well. They suffered the same targetted execution (though I'm not sure, if their whole clan was stripped/punished otherwise or not).
I consider Hoss's addressing us with the botting issues prior to the strip to be a plain and simple trick of manipulation, so as to relay the burden of responsibility for his decision unto us ("see, i warned you, and you still did it! bad, bad guys, i strip your clan (just your clan, as an example to others), and its all YOUR fault!"). That's VERY cheap. My daughter does better :-)

Anyway, what point did you try to promote? That you're happy that we were punished?
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: btown on July 02, 2013, 08:57:36 AM
So how many people did this effect..  excluding the bots of course lmao

Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Slunt on July 02, 2013, 02:17:06 PM
Correct Me if i am wrong Jozheg but are you not using the exact same tactic back on Hoss? Not that hoss did any such thing. He really gave you a warning and a chance to stop on your own accord. I say you should grow up you are the violators you can not somehow twist it around using moron logic onto the game administration.

That being said i think a single Multi/bot should be allowed.
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Malthros on July 02, 2013, 07:08:53 PM
Hoss is such a puppetmaster that warning you guys was manipulation on his part?  I think the tinfoil might be cutting off the flow of blood to your brain if you believe that.

You were told to stop. You didn't stop.  Did you think he was just going to go "we'll they called my bluff better let the go" or what?
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Chisul on July 02, 2013, 10:02:41 PM
Amen.

I've never grouped (knowingly) with bots...probably because I don't IRC while playing, where I am certain the topic of botting is being discussed.

I have, however, been killed by bot armies before and it is BY FAR the most infuriating aspect of Arctic. People spouting negativity, being hunted, summon pk, DT...hell even training camp is better than getting whacked by a couple people who are obviously breaking the rules. To me, this falls along the exact same lines as bread bombing people so they cannot recall...it's an exploitation of the game mechanics to kill others. Period.

I've waffled back and forth on if botting should be allowed or not, but until a day comes when it is available for everyone I applaud every single time someone gets stripped or abyssed or deleted for pulling this crap.

The "but everyone else is doing it" argument is just plain crap as well. I know several players well enough to say they have NEVER multi logged, character shared, or botted for skills or PK.

I love this game. I've played for over 15 years now and I have always known where the line has been drawn with regards to this topic...it hasn't changed and there are no surprises. It should come as no surprise to you or anyone else that this is exactly where the road you chose to walk would take you.

Matt
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: btown on July 02, 2013, 10:49:18 PM
Good post,  nobody likes bots and the ones who do spam cyan
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Loretta on July 03, 2013, 03:03:43 AM
Point is the Hoss let bots grow unstead of delete em from v start and dont need to punish whole clan. Now he talking some shit about i warn you - baptyou asshole you just help your fellow natural born suckers to peaceful zone.
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Jozheg on July 03, 2013, 04:25:24 AM
Slunt:
No.
Firstly, I do not want a thing from Kirt. No goal = no manipulation.
Secondly, I didn't say he's wrong, he's right as far as the rule policing goes. We've done wrong, we're punished for our personal sins. No relaying of responsibility.

To sum my previous post up, what infuriates me is that we were chosen just like Jesus to be crucified for the sins of the whole mud. But the word wasn't spread, the book wasn't written, so how does it help to fight the botting issue on the larger scale? No news, no posts from the hand, that bestowed the God's wrath upon Sodom and Bomorrah! Silence. So, where's the proclaimed lesson to the others?
That pretty much smells of discrimination, not justice.

Malthros:
So, in your world you do not drive drunk only if an officer stops you and says to not do it?
The law should be universal. You decide to force it, you force it everywhere where it's broken.

Matt:
My argument is not "but everyone else is doing it", but "everyone doing it should be punished".
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: btown on July 03, 2013, 06:17:11 AM
I agree. delete them all!
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Malthros on July 03, 2013, 03:38:34 PM
Malthros:
So, in your world you do not drive drunk only if an officer stops you and says to not do it?
The law should be universal. You decide to force it, you force it everywhere where it's broken.

I don't drive drunk because it's illegal.

If I did drive drunk, got caught, and only got a warning I'd be thankful for the act of mercy.  In this case SoB decided to swing by the liquor store and grab a fresh bottle and then drive down the same road where that cop was parked.

Your example was pretty awful either way.  Perhaps you'd prefer if Hoss just nuke you outright next time.
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Essex on July 03, 2013, 04:39:18 PM
But the word wasn't spread, the book wasn't written, so how does it help to fight the botting issue on the larger scale? No news, no posts from the hand, that bestowed the God's wrath upon Sodom and Bomorrah! Silence. So, where's the proclaimed lesson to the others?

If you genuinely think that the only people who know about this happening are the readers of this forum, you've forgotten exactly how small Arctic has gotten. Everyone knew by like day three, those of us that have logged in since then, for several obvious reasons. Funny thing is, the moral of this story isn't not to cheat, but to report those that do, because when they get busted, more loot loads for the rest of us.

My question is, what the hell is with comparing yourself to Jesus?
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: eddiex on July 03, 2013, 08:26:22 PM
The point of my post is that i was bored and wanted something to read from my arctic brethren.

"I've waffled back and forth on if botting should be allowed or not, but until a day comes when it is available for everyone I applaud every single time someone gets stripped or abyssed or deleted for pulling this crap."

Agreed. 

I think there is a huge problem with a multi/bot justification which i've read from a member of SoB forum posts.  Something to the effect of 'We started the wipe clean, but when our numbers dipped we started multi/botting'.  The problem with this is that by multiing/botting you increase your zoning power, helping you do zones more efficiently to potentially maintain equipment sets or items.  Also if you're multi/botting and pking thats just lame, plain and simple.
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Jorquin on July 05, 2013, 07:37:50 PM
who even cares, honestly. last i checked arctic struggles to break 15 characters at many times of the day. better delete the bots so theres only 8!
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Super Tacoman on July 06, 2013, 09:39:08 AM
The point of my post is that i was bored and wanted something to read from my arctic brethren.

"I've waffled back and forth on if botting should be allowed or not, but until a day comes when it is available for everyone I applaud every single time someone gets stripped or abyssed or deleted for pulling this crap."

Agreed. 

I think there is a huge problem with a multi/bot justification which i've read from a member of SoB forum posts.  Something to the effect of 'We started the wipe clean, but when our numbers dipped we started multi/botting'.  The problem with this is that by multiing/botting you increase your zoning power, helping you do zones more efficiently to potentially maintain equipment sets or items.  Also if you're multi/botting and pking thats just lame, plain and simple.

this last wipe i joined groups, i led groups.  i tanked and i healed.  i powerleveled newbies and gave them coins and showed them where to find tablets.  i also multied.  having played with and without multis i can tell you there is no comparison.  as you say they increase zoning power.  they also drastically decrease boredom.  i wont ever go back to playing this game with just 1 char.  if i dont play my friends dont play.  do you really want to stop me and other players like me from playing this game?  would the game really be better off without us?
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Aemon on July 06, 2013, 10:12:42 AM
Also if you're multi/botting and pking thats just lame, plain and simple.

SoB were the most active pkillers and we had bots after a number of key players quit. But a lot of people get those two distinct things confused, the correlation between pk and bots is not 1.0 but closer to like 0.2, at least for SoB. With PoG a couple years ago, the correlation was much higher. PK was mostly done by Essovius and Veigar (a human) who helped us police our enemies' alts. The bots weren't ever used for pk unless it was against BiA and dele who also have bots and know what they're up against. Or if someone was just aggravating (summoning us), that might be another case. But I think many people have a misconception that there was some patrolling death squad of bots. That's far from true. Check the in-game pk command.

Yes you could say bots increase zoning power and help you dominate your playing time, I do not disagree with that. But at the tier we play at, our competition BiA and dele also employed bots, and in fact actively hunted us with bots. The bots of SoB never actively hunted Myth or Maza. I think Maza would probably even admit as much, Myth is less objective and a lot more whiney.

Arctic has been on a secular decline for over a decade, I think everyone recognizes that. Each time, the solution to bots has been to chop off the arm to save the body. No effort has ever been made to find a sustainable solution, all the while Arctic decays as there are fewer limbs to cut off and the playerbase withers away. I should just leave these threads alone and come back in a year when I only have Hoss and 2 mortal minions to debate because that's the path Arctic is currently on. It's scary but the only voice of reason in the forums these days seems to be Daniel.
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: btown on July 06, 2013, 11:58:26 AM
omg can you stop whining already?  the only voice of reason is another major botter? lmao.  FACT IS you aren't half what u think u are with ZERO bots!!  same with dele and all the other botters.  yea you guys still can control but without bots its a different ball game
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Jorquin on July 07, 2013, 02:11:52 AM
i think you need to relax buddy
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: btown on July 07, 2013, 11:48:04 AM
what its true
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Bryton on July 07, 2013, 06:45:31 PM
Umm we controlled the first 3 months of the wipe without bots.. Brandon you're retarded go back to your hole.
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Rezin on July 09, 2013, 07:57:00 AM
If your trying to make yourself feel better about how much you pissed off the rest of the mud, and made it completely unenjoyable for yourself I hope its working, but the fact is, your clan DID hunt myth and maza as soon as you ran off any of your actual competition, when either clanned tried to get peace from you, they get directed for weeks to 3 different leaders within the same clan who make it next to impossible, and even if somehow they do get peace from some, you still don't get peace from your other goon squad of RGB that has been laming the mud up for a good 15 years now...and since SOB has left the mud, the # of people that have returned is 100% more beneficial to the game, instead of 1 player and 9 bots playing and keeping 75% of the people that want to play off, now theres 20-30 people playing and no bots, so your argument that in punishing your clan and causing them to leave made more people leave the mud...my response is good riddance, your presence did nothing but piss off everyone who wanted to run around and explore with there friends.  Sure its a pk mud, and if your group of people were really interested in clan battles and clan warfare, maybe instead of ambushing anyone who could have posed any type of threat thus taking out all of there main characters so they have an uphill battle trying to face your clan from that point on is a shitty time, not to mention even if only 1 or 2 of your players are online playing, you still field 10 man groups, forcing anyone that wants to face you into either botting or not playing, of course they could roll new characters and try to stay unknown, but at least 5 people I know that have tried to come back this wipe were killed before they reached level 10 by your 'essovius' and 'veigars' how does killing someone before they can even become a threat satisfy your desire to have active clan battling and a pk environment?
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Rezin on July 09, 2013, 08:00:54 AM
Maybe if you hadn't of abused the power you had being able to field a 10 man group with 1 person controlling them all by killing every single person online, the mud wouldn't have complained so much and you wouldn't have been stripped of gear and punished, at times I can remember trying to ask your clan if I was being hunted or my friends were being hunted, only to receive the response, the entire mud should fear us right now, because you aren't trying to defend your clan, you aren't trying to have pk battles, you are bored and you are trying to kill anyone you can find anywhere, a lot of us have been playing this game for over a decade, act like you have matured with the game and use some common god damn sense, try to be a bit more conservative with your power trip, maybe don't be so arrogant as to say, just cause we are cheating that means everyone else is as well, so that makes it ok
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Cosmo on July 09, 2013, 09:40:21 AM
Please keep all posts to 140 chars or less #thatisall
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: btown on July 09, 2013, 11:00:27 AM
I remember last wipe we were doing cyan and we tried to bot a shaman char to be our summoner and hoss caught us and shouted out we were botting.   that was pretty damn embarrassing to me and I felt like a scum cheater.  however you guys seem to feel justified and pride as if you were saving the game by keeping your bots active.  just shows the difference in POV. 
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Rezin on July 09, 2013, 03:28:06 PM
exactly btown, they keep stating that they were doing it cuz the mud is dead and since they got punished there goes half the mud, but in reality, the reason the mud lost most of its people is because of the shitty way they played and treated other players, and since they have left the mud, theres just as many ppl playing if not more now that the scum element has been removed, how can you honestly think you were doing us a favor loading high level equipment for yourselfs and killing anyone who is opt anon or any name you don't recognize
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Jorquin on July 10, 2013, 12:00:41 AM
i see brandon admitting he's a scummy botter
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Brafu on July 10, 2013, 03:15:16 AM
I'm not sure how anyone can justify using bots/multi'ing by even suggesting that it helps the mud. When a clan bots in order to maintain the power they achieved with real people it only hurts the game and other players/clans. It really creates an imbalance and does anything but help the mud. Why? Because now the clan can log a 10 man virtually at will and doesn't need to worry about half the headaches other non-bot using clans do when they try to organize zoning (or pk). Getting 3 or 4 people together and on the same page is a hell of a lot easier than 10 who have the attention span of a gnat.

Not to mention those bots are using eq that should rightfully have been recycled into the eq ecosystem, or even not loaded for those chars in the first place.

If it was confined to a much smaller scale (such as a couple friends using a healer bot so they can have some fun zoning), then it wouldn't be such a big issue. But it's when clans use bots to give them an unfair edge over the competition that the real issues show up.
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: DCPTY1986 on July 10, 2013, 11:31:04 AM
Regardless with and without bots we killed eveybody off the mud anyway.

- Dale (Chorillo)
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Joe on July 10, 2013, 03:44:06 PM
Back in my day Cale would repeatedly damn myself and others for a week or more for telling noobs how to greet the constable of Solace. Now people are botting rampantly *smh*
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: eddiex on July 11, 2013, 02:08:10 AM
Super Tacoman, I have multi'd before.  I've openly admitted it.  You know the difference between me and you?  I am willing to not exploit the loophole because it obviously gives a severe disadvantage to non-multiers.  If multiing was allowed for all would this even be an issue? Obviously not, but since it is not technically allowed:

It's hilarious how multiers run around screaming "OH SO YOU THINK IT'D BE BETTER WITHOUT US, HUH!"

Yes it would.  More gear would be loading that those who don't abuse the system, whom may not ever had a chance to have besides mindlessly following around clan leaders, would have a chance to harvest. [You know why people play borderlands to the endgame or something similar?  To load that orange loot, that you multiing pricks are hoarding.]

When multiing you're concentrating on two characters which reduces your interactivity with the playerbase.  Even the LIVE players in your group don't converse. [Maybe you have found a likeminded group of people who like to watch text fly around like the matrix, just knowing that you're with another person, but having no active interaction.]

You want to know the biggest problem with multiing?  Some of the biggest culprits are also the most knowledgeable and skilled players in this game.  Maybe you are only children, but anyone who is an undersibling understands this concept.
[Remember when your big brother wouldn't let you play the game because you suck at it and it was a waste of his time to watch?  Well those people quit playing video games all together because they never got a chance to play] BOOM! you retarded SoBs.  And i don't mean the clan.
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: DCPTY1986 on July 11, 2013, 07:50:57 AM
Good Luck popping that gear with the remaining 7 people playing this game.
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: enochvey on July 11, 2013, 10:41:36 AM
"Good Luck popping that gear with the remaining 7 people playing this game."

I've never seen gear load like this before actually. Since I got back, it's been amazing to not to have an army of alts and/or trash chars hoarding every possible drop at every zone level for once.

The greatly increased availability of gear has done quite a bit to help my exploration efforts. Knowing that I can get reequipped again within a reasonable time frame after a death/lack of cr has helped me learn more game content in the last week that is immediately beneficial to my char than I did in months previously just following clan leaders.

As far as the number of players goes, I remember seeing 150 or so online before around 10 years ago. Now someone might say, wait 150 max vs the 30 or so max we see now... see I TOLD you I was God's gift to the mud!

But aside from arctic's more modern competition, you know what the number one reason for people leaving the game was back then? Same as it is now, a certain portion of the playerbase doing everything inside and outside of the rules to make the game miserable for everyone else and sadly getting away with it a decent portion of the time.

Do you know the number one reason why people continue to play and come back to the game despite what should probably be considered their better judgment? If you can take a guess its not your bots.

Rather it's the hard work put out by the coders and zone designers that make this game stupidly addicting. It's the somewhat unique combat and exploration system that allows players to experience what its like to put in singificant time and effort to overcome a specific challenge with or without the help of others and be able to enjoy the results of their labor.   

War and PK will always be part of arctic, thats what adds to the challenge of it all. But the relentless, strangling opression that some have tried to cover the entire playerbase with does nothing to facilitate the survival of the game amidst its more mordern competition. Pking Bots, well timed fooms, Morgion blasting me with cones of cold and destroying my equipment for not flattering him etc, are things which are not supposed to be part of the game. It is better off without them.
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Brafu on July 11, 2013, 11:34:24 AM
Good Luck popping that gear with the remaining 7 people playing this game.

Obviously you have not seen a group of 4 legendary chars destroy high end zones that were meant for 10, or a group of 2 smash most every other zone. With legendary char's virtually all eq is obtainable by anyone who learns how to snag it.
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: btown on July 11, 2013, 11:41:28 AM
Don't bother replying to "Dale"  he use to be a real person now he is just a drone bot
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Gramm on July 11, 2013, 02:26:23 PM
If all you want to do on arctic is get large enough to run around gang raping everyone else, perhaps you should stop pretending you actually care about the playerbase. Treat it like hunting or fishing, if you snag every deer in the forest in a single week, you will find nothing to hunt in the next week. Even if you have a 10 man with 0 bots. You are an idiot to believe your doing anything but hurt this mud by abusing that power by having the other 15-20 people online sit in the inn until you rent. Seriously disabled, there is no bus on earth short enough for you. If you want to troll like a bunch of children, go play a different game... You can tell yourself this mud will be worse off without you, your incorrect and well beyond confused. There are games based purely on trying to kill other people, lots and lots and lots of them, theres a lot more to arctic than just pk. If you are at the point where there isnt... piss off.
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Bryton on July 11, 2013, 03:01:17 PM
@gramm or you can just quit being a forum troll, and put your effort into trying to stop us..
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Gramm on July 11, 2013, 04:32:42 PM
You would love that because you would be able to amass another horde and stomp another good group of folks out of the mud. I cannot compete with those that have been pking for decades now, i am a zone style player i love to teach folks and learn at the same time. We both aim for different goals in arctic you and I. With a giant playerbase I would enjoy trying perhaps but with a 5 man clan at any given time, tell me how am i to stop you? not only that but we dont have insomniacs spamming the wholist to "police" enemy alts..
I take more enjoyment out of killing my own friends by accident, than hunting people that KNOW where to run and hide as soon as they surprise poof rape some poor unsuspecting zoner. Loretta is way too pro to be doing what he has been doing, it does not suit his true abilities. He has earned my respect but i still wish the man would change his evil ways against those unable to defend themselves.
And also i hear all these awesome and mighty things about how shesh is a good player and this and that and the other, why does he insist on keeping zoners in the inn? Im simply speaking my mind and im sure im not the only one thinking what I say to you all. Since sob has left i have been able to help gear up at least 3 returning players and help 2 other friends legend. If sob was still around none of that would have happened and id be waiting for time just to go solo ct for coins to further my deep rent. Once again i say No excuse for your behaviour bryton but then again... every single wipe you step way past the lowest bars your clans even condone. This is the first wipe you have a posse doing what you enjoy most. Heckling the rest of the mud.
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Brafu on July 11, 2013, 05:02:36 PM
@Bryton

It's been done to death... stopping people like you that is. The problem is that the people who have the most issue with the way you, and some others, choose to play is that for you it's fun, but for others its just annoying and part of the downside of playing Arctic. The same reason you might stop mudding is the same reason people stop mudding when people like you are around... lack of fun and no reason to play.

But.. *shrugs*

Just my opinion.
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Jorquin on July 12, 2013, 09:21:36 PM
the ridiculous part is most of the people who post on these forums dont even play this game anymore, myself included

yet for some reason a particular member of staff seems to have taken it upon himself to systematically alienate multiple playing groups in a floundering player base

"death to botters, dont cheat if you cant accept the punishment, etc" will surely come next. thats all well and good - almost everyone who says it here has either quit, barely plays or is some staff member who doesn't play a mortal except for 1 hour a week.

questionable motives to say the least. sometimes i wonder if the one dishing out these punishments is on the payrole of league of legends
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: relethane on July 13, 2013, 12:17:23 AM
As a long term noob I have a few observations about why this game has had a constantly shrinking player base:

1.  Most of the people who still play have played Arctic for a long time and know everything about Arctic.  These same players, by virtue of being the (albeit small) playerbase have a large influence on Arctic policy.

2.  Most of these people want a larger player base so they have more people to pick on.  They actually don't want honest competition.   

3.  Trying to grow the playerbase while maintaining the state of Arctic such that the current "power group" retains power and can pick on all newcomers just doesn't work.  Noobs realize they're permanently stuck with a huge disadvantage and give up.

I've played other MUDs that have died from this disease, where one core group "wins" and then controls MUD policy to insure that it continues to win for the rest of time.  This kills the playerbase.  WoW deals with this problem by only having two "clans", and any noob would automatically be part of half of the powerful group.  Eve deals with this problem by having hi-sec space where everyone has a decent chance to grow their power.  Arctic just has death zones should the in power group decide.

So I guess I'm saying - to get more people to join the MUD, you have to give them a real chance to compete with you.  And no, a real chance does not mean they can always ask you for help to get powerful.  That is not competition.

P.S. The only reason I really care is that I've found Arctic has the best zones out of any MUD / MMO I've ever played.
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Brafu on July 13, 2013, 04:55:50 AM
@daniel

I think most of us lurk on these forums to try and help Arctic grow and evolve. I know I'm trying to be more constructive in my posts than I might have been in the past, and it's because I still love the game, even though I just can't bring myself to put in the time and effort anymore because, for me at-least, it's just too toxic. I play games to relax and have fun, not to get into a Hatfield and McCoy type feud with this group or that every wipe.
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: reed23 on July 13, 2013, 02:50:39 PM
Why don't hoss and aristox ever chime in on the thread?  Strange.
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: RaVaN on July 13, 2013, 03:32:01 PM
  Probably too much bitching, accusations, and whining and not enough tangible solutions...and I mean bitching and whining from both "sides".  For the most part, these are all just regurgitated arguments of varying truth but with a lot more lameness. You know the threads are being read however by the amount of Loretta posts getting deleted...which I tend to think is annoying as hell for the moderators to be doing since Loretta tends to have valid points and thoughts once you get past the Rage of the RGB.
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: reed23 on July 13, 2013, 10:22:36 PM
Probably true Ravan, Probably true, i guess all fodder like me would want is some sign of life from the mothership and what direction (if any) the mud is going.  Or a simple hey fodder, haven't given 2 thoughts about the mud in the past 4 months. 
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Nostramazos on July 15, 2013, 03:27:17 PM

@ Ravan

Dear Ravan, you cannot really equate the two view points presented in these forums. One is based on the aspects of the game that make it fun such as zoning, grouping, dieing and dting. The other is based on devoting all time and energy in hunting people who will not, do not, have no inclination to hunt back.

Thus, one group is not bitching but is stating the obvious. "We cannot play the game as we could and, for a number of reasons most relating to time restrictions, we will not go after these people."

The other group, however, is engaging in constant bitching. When they win a battle, they display class and sash, the "I don't care attitude, it's just a game." But when they lose...have you talked to them after they died?

I have. Tears came through my screen. For a period of time the world is a cruel hateful place, full of wrong and injustice and a public that is against the efforts to make this game fun. Bipolarism though does not stay in one state for too long. Rage comes after the tears, immense hate and bitterness and thoughts of vengeance through blood carnage. And then comes the power tripping, constant, relentless and oppressive for them and us.

There is no doubt that the second view point is unsustainable. Firstly, arctic is not a game any more but a job of penis worshiping. Secondly, hate will keep you awake only for so much. Thirdly, eating chips all day makes you fat and sitting in a chair all night hurts your back.

The zapping of their e.q. was in fact a chance for liberation from an oppressive state of being and SOB took it. They are free now, hovering in the bliss of "forced retreat by higher powers". They will be back cause bad habits and sick relationships try hard. And the cycle will begin anew.

@ all: Some further comments.

Between Maza, Kos, Myth quitting the game and Sob quitting it, I choose Sob. Just my personal opinion though. Also SOB remember, we are not laughing with you but at you.

Solutions for next wipe on the pk concern code tagging clans or characters as no pk with whatever limitations that may bring in eq. That will be the key (not levels or ranks, we still like to kill higher end mobs).

Anyone who rage quits over being pked once or losing eq, should not play this game. Maza provides help to individuals with PK issues as victims or perpetrators through the program On Edge Of Extermination (OEOE) where we dress you up with eq and make you dt.

Nostramazos
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: RaVaN on July 15, 2013, 05:22:42 PM
@Nostramazos

  I think you are under a misconception of what the two sides are.  There is RGB+thralls and everyone else.  If people understand that they would be better off.

Red Goblins Law.
 About Me:
 1. Me rules.
 2. All Me says you must do..
 3. If Me says nothing, you can do what you want.
 2.1. If Me says something, you may not do it, but Me will bash you.

 About Stuff and Other
 1.Who looted it, keeps it.
 2. What you looted, that you keep.
 3. If you looted something that killed you - don't whine after.
 3.2. Looted too much, - share with a comrade or be buckled and die.
 3.3 Don't know with whom to share - give it to Me, Me knows.
 4. Found Stuff and it is not tied - bring it to clan.
     You don't need - some other needs.

 About Enemies.
 1. If you dont know someone - sure hes Enemies.
 2. Friends of Enemies - sux and must die.
 3. Found a Enemies and hes not held - hold it and bring to clan.
     You dont need - some other needs.
 4. If bored - bash Enemies
 5. Found a Enemies and he wants to bash you - run fast, may be hes not
 Enemies.
 6. Found many Enemies - run fast and tell Me. We will go Hunt them.

 About Fights and Hunt
 1. If all go hunt Enemies - you also go.
 2. If noone go hunt Enemies - dont go alone or they will bash you.
 3. If unknown comes and tells you to hunt Enemies - better run, he must be
 Enemies.
 4. If someone killing Enemies nearby - wait until finished, loot and bring
 to Me.
 
 What to do if  Enemies caught you.
 1. If Enemies caught you - you sux and must die. We wont help you.
 2. If Enemies ask you something - answer the truth: you sux and know
 nothing.


  If people would live by RGB law life would be a lot more easier for them.  Anyhow this was amusing and key to understanding the current Arctic politics:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICqnUARLyUU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICqnUARLyUU)
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Dyl on July 15, 2013, 11:48:00 PM
And the award goes to Keila for best actress.
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Gramm on July 17, 2013, 04:03:44 AM
OMG i forgot that awesome video was around.. OeooeoOEOEoeoe
Title: Re: This game is funny (just a few observations from this wipe)
Post by: Quid on December 30, 2014, 06:14:10 AM
Best. Rules. Ever!