Arctic Mud

ArcticMUD => General Discussion => Topic started by: reed23 on May 25, 2013, 11:52:49 AM

Title: Multiing/Botting
Post by: reed23 on May 25, 2013, 11:52:49 AM
With the mud in its mid-wipe 20 player average, why not allow each player to play 2 chars from each IP and just see how it goes?  The players voted yes last wipe on the forums, why not just see how it goes, nothing to lose???  It would make mid wipe a little more exciting until the big LUBE hook comes in to hook everyone next wipe.
Title: Re: Multiing/Botting
Post by: Dyl on May 25, 2013, 12:01:25 PM
Why not stop being a dick and the other 20 might play?  Or you just want to play with youself?
Title: Re: Multiing/Botting
Post by: reed23 on May 25, 2013, 12:14:06 PM
^^^^ Lol, who is this douche?
Title: Re: Multiing/Botting
Post by: Loretta on May 25, 2013, 12:16:36 PM
Hell no, we dont want to see those bapting wild cheaters in game anymore. If they want to play they should fight for they rights to play in this game or just suck a dick.
Title: Re: Multiing/Botting
Post by: Kir on May 25, 2013, 12:59:58 PM
should either allow bots or actually police bots

half the clans in this game botted the entire wipe and only two times to my knowledge were any of the bots deleted. I'd estimate there are probably between 25-35 ranked bots in this game (lets say 30), so 2/30 isn't very good.

I don't have a problem with bots really, I did not bot this wipe (or allow my clan to bot) just to challenge myself and enjoy pvp with wilds without having to worry about being deleted. However its more work than its worth and I won't be playing hardcore again unless botting is legalized or there is an actual policy put in place and enforced that makes the game as close to fair as possible.

I still think that the best policy I've heard so for recommended was to allow only 1 char per 1 ip and other than that, take a hands off approach. Mud will police itself etc. Its just annoying trying to play by the rules when others are not, and I really feel bad for people who do play by the rules and then get pked by a 10man finnbot army. Although the latter has not happened this wipe, it is definitely possible still.

Oh and yes, botting is more fun than playing by the rules. Sorry if you don't know this, but this is my opinion and it is shared by many others. It just sucks people who try to follow the rules don't get to have as much fun\equipment\ranks\skills\zoning as those who do not.
Title: Re: Multiing/Botting
Post by: Davy on May 25, 2013, 06:49:30 PM
I have never had a bot but would probably have one if allowed.
Title: Re: Multiing/Botting
Post by: Gnua on May 26, 2013, 11:03:26 PM
I have never had a bot but would probably have one if allowed.

I tried multiing on chaos day and had trouble 3manning some fights that were pretty easy with two real player. My guess is I would need a fairly advanced set of scripts to make multiing feasible.
Title: Re: Multiing/Botting
Post by: xellos on May 30, 2013, 04:54:20 PM
please let me play both my legend mages at the same time. terrorize engaged.
Title: Re: Multiing/Botting
Post by: Jorquin on June 03, 2013, 09:37:06 PM
until you get rolled by someone playing two legendary bashers
Title: Re: Multiing/Botting
Post by: Sabibi on June 19, 2013, 12:57:36 AM
Title: Re: Multiing/Botting
Post by: btown on June 19, 2013, 06:08:38 AM
yes you have been cheated.  i would email the immortals several times over
Title: Re: Multiing/Botting
Post by: Sabibi on June 19, 2013, 07:35:48 AM
Yes, cheated. Every deed has own outcome. I know it.

And i think that is 2 weeks for cheating like me it's not adequate (im not uber-botter, i don't play high-end game, i don't use it against other players).
When characters was abyssed immortal (who punished me) keep self hidden, he do not asked me anything, don't give me any chance to explain. Strange... We all mature. And Arctic is nice hobby for all us (code for one, play for other and vise versa).

I write to Aristox and now wait for his decision.
Title: Re: Multiing/Botting
Post by: corey on June 19, 2013, 04:34:43 PM
Yes, cheated. Every deed has own outcome. I know it.

And i think that is 2 weeks for cheating like me it's not adequate (im not uber-botter, i don't play high-end game, i don't use it against other players).
When characters was abyssed immortal (who punished me) keep self hidden, he do not asked me anything, don't give me any chance to explain. Strange... We all mature. And Arctic is nice hobby for all us (code for one, play for other and vise versa).

I write to Aristox and now wait for his decision.

Just stop playing for now
Title: Re: Multiing/Botting
Post by: Hoss on June 19, 2013, 07:20:58 PM
@Sabibi, I am sorry to hear that you had a poor experience with your cheating. I am disappointed with the immortal that dealt with your case, not with the punishment mind you, but with the fact that they did not go visible to you and explain why you were being punished. Do not expect the ruling on the field to be overturned, but you can expect that "someone" won't be performing any disciplinary actions from here on out.
Title: Re: Multiing/Botting
Post by: Sabibi on June 19, 2013, 11:46:54 PM
Poor cheating experience will be indemnified with rich punishment experience.
Title: Re: Multiing/Botting
Post by: Jorake on June 22, 2013, 01:26:28 PM
should either allow bots or actually police bots

half the clans in this game botted the entire wipe and only two times to my knowledge were any of the bots deleted. I'd estimate there are probably between 25-35 ranked bots in this game (lets say 30), so 2/30 isn't very good.

I don't have a problem with bots really, I did not bot this wipe (or allow my clan to bot) just to challenge myself and enjoy pvp with wilds without having to worry about being deleted. However its more work than its worth and I won't be playing hardcore again unless botting is legalized or there is an actual policy put in place and enforced that makes the game as close to fair as possible.

I still think that the best policy I've heard so for recommended was to allow only 1 char per 1 ip and other than that, take a hands off approach. Mud will police itself etc. Its just annoying trying to play by the rules when others are not, and I really feel bad for people who do play by the rules and then get pked by a 10man finnbot army. Although the latter has not happened this wipe, it is definitely possible still.

Oh and yes, botting is more fun than playing by the rules. Sorry if you don't know this, but this is my opinion and it is shared by many others. It just sucks people who try to follow the rules don't get to have as much fun\equipment\ranks\skills\zoning as those who do not.


Kir is jack? SoB? You did not allow your clan to bot? Listen. EVERY CLAN has bots. and EVERY ONE knows it. I don't care if you are bapting KoS or Myth or Wild or Dele or Apoc or who the bapt ever. They have all had bots. So why bullshit? AND If Kir is not SoB then ignore this post. But cmon buddy. Cmon
Title: Re: Multiing/Botting
Post by: reed23 on June 22, 2013, 03:52:32 PM
Kir is SOB and you can believe it or not, but we did not bot AT ALL the first 2 months of the wipe.  When the clan fizzled out when we all got bored after 8 weeks, i cannot answer for that.  Kir played a GOOD ALIGNED thief because we needed A. a leader for the good aligned rush group and B. a thief in the clan.  Believe me, if we were botting, the first thing that would have happened is the clan leader wouldn't have made the most retarded class/align choice in the world.
Title: Re: Multiing/Botting
Post by: Hoodoo on June 22, 2013, 05:40:51 PM
Bots annoy the hell out of me, in an unholy synthesis of the annoyances of rampant imm cheating of the distant past (Shriners!), and the inevitably enhanced knowledge of anyone who builds or imms.   I don't begrudge the builders: they do the work, and the knowledge they glean is small payment for some of the zones we have.  However, botting allows players to figure zones they wouldn't otherwise be able to access without taking other real people along to help.  This furthers the 'elitist' aspect of this game, far and away the least attractive of the various blemishes which hold this game back.  An example:

I've been Myth for over a decade.  A few years ago, one of our major leaders of the wipe (a recent addition to the clan) multi'd through an entire wipe, dirtying our groups with both his characters regularly, and using the cleric/scout combination to explore a  new high-end zone without exposing anyone else to the knowledge. Now, at this point, he'd involved a (mostly) unknowing clan in his cheating.  For anyone who watched the Harpers get mass-deleted, this is a major problem.  However, an honest player, concerned about enriching his clan, would have explored the new high-end zones with other clannies, strengthening the clan and enhancing play for everyone.  This is a social game, and at its' best when it *is* social.  This cheater's actions harmed the game for everyone on multiple levels, for an entire wipe. 

 Here's the problem.  While people bot openly and receive no punishment, the bot will win.  The previously described player did this for almost a year, in a major clan with no fewer than 3 imms who played regularly *with this player*, and nobody said anything.  Why?  Because he was our best-geared healer, he equipped himself, and due to his botting, he was one of the few people who could lead this new, high-end zone.  Exactly 2 people in the clan thanked me for reporting him: a few people happily supported his plans to pk me once a week 'until I quit playing'. 

Players will not enforce the rules as long as they can gain comparative advantage by abusing them.    Saying that the imms don't know who the bots are is patently ridiculous: of the last 3-4 logs on Sufs, at least half of one side has been filled by known bots.  These bots were known as such a couple months ago when I played actively, under the same names, by *every person who ever grouped with them*.  It's not subtle: they stack commands like pardons without a prompt in between.  The imms I reported them to (multiple) simply had no more bapts to give, though.  Nobody cares.

And as long as nobody cares, the cheaters will continue to prosper.

Jason

Fyre/Siobhain/Hoodoo/etc.
Title: Re: Multiing/Botting
Post by: Jorquin on June 23, 2013, 04:34:51 AM
i find it incredible that people are still kicking and screaming to push for alienation and sanctions against the few people struggling to enjoy whats left of a dying game.
the bot posse rolling around killing people is a little extreme though.

not that i give a shit, i stopped playing quite some time ago
Title: Re: Multiing/Botting
Post by: Ymir on June 23, 2013, 04:35:57 PM
However, botting allows players to figure zones they wouldn't otherwise be able to access without taking other real people along to help.  This furthers the 'elitist' aspect of this game, far and away the least attractive of the various blemishes which hold this game back. 

Stop being asked to be taken along. You even have a log now to make life easier and quicker for you or multiple you(s) to see what he has done. Stop being a drone and become a leader, organize and take people along or just make better friends.

You are entitled to your opinion, but in my opinion that has to be the weakest reason made yet to be anti-botting.
Title: Re: Multiing/Botting
Post by: Hoodoo on June 24, 2013, 05:33:45 PM
What, that a social game should be social?  *chuckle*

Figured Daniel would respond to this.  *waves*

Ymir, I couldn't care less about learning Ravenshadow myself.  I know more than enough zones/keywords/etc to lead, and I know enough people to get anything I need to run lead easily. I choose to not lead because keeping more than 3 people focused on the same thing for 5 minutes in today's Arctic is like herding cats.   You missed the point, and proved my 'elitist asshat' point, all at once, Ymir.   Just because someone says 'I hate bots because it allows 1 person to run a zone without any other people', it does *not* mean 'I want to whine because nobody showed me anything and my pussy hurts.'   When I give a shit about a zone, I figure it out. 

This game is at its best when a group consists of a few friends working together, not when 1 guy and 4 bots are steamrolling zones and calling it 'ownage'.    It looks like those days are dead and gone, but I played when people still gave a shit about the botting rules, if nothing else.   Times were better, then.

Jason
Title: Re: Multiing/Botting
Post by: Ymir on June 25, 2013, 01:29:50 AM
You missed the point, and proved my 'elitist asshat' point, all at once, Ymir.   Just because someone says 'I hate bots because it allows 1 person to run a zone without any other people', it does *not* mean 'I want to whine because nobody showed me anything and my pussy hurts.'

I'm sorry, but that is actually exactly what that post sounded like. You sound like you got butthurt because you clannie didn't share the keywords with you, especially when you admit you can't scrounge up people or can't bother or be bothered to make the requisite effort to become a leader.
 
Being a leader is not about preventing your group members from having fun while playing and just focusing on making you the leaders life easier, by shutupping up about random things, cracking no jokes, not goofing about, not letting life pull them afk, and generally turning into drones. Leading large groups of people has always required a great deal of patience and as you put it "herding of cats".

Oh wait, I see it, you are jealous about bots because they are the perfect group members that you actually seek for your exploring from a log. Anyway, now I think we are drifting off-topic because this is no longer about bots, so I will sign off.

You are entitled to your opinion, but I don't believe that others botting keeps me from exploring any zone I care to or prevents me from acquiring game knowledge.

Gives them more of an edge, sure, but they better have logs already. I believe real players are greater than bots and with no zoning being mass rip free, good luck to the botter, he better have mad scripting skills.

PS If you have a log and can't explore ravenshadow on more than 3-4 legends you are doing something wrong, a lot of those areas are accessible to even soloers with some skill, you don't need a buff 10 man all the time for your exploratory visits.