Author Topic: Reincarnation  (Read 3378 times)

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Jorake

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Re: Reincarnation
« Reply #30 on: June 27, 2019, 09:25:10 PM »
Delaying legend is fine as long as you can access legend races. Which it sounds like we will be able to.

I would very much almost beg the imms to leave any skill gains the same if possible? I don't know how that would work, i know i have prelearned spells before. And then they show up in my slot when i get that slot. Any way to make skills stay the same? So if i hit lvl 30 1x and i superb all the useful skills that I need for my character etc. Exp grind is the 2nd worst when you actually focus on the exp and not just zoning. Which sometimes when no one else is on and even with 2 guys you can only focus on that exp. Level 29-30 is like 45mil to? or some such. So 45mil x 6 reincarnates = 270million exp from lvl 29 to 30. So that means  you have to wait ALL that time which for some folks could be weeks really, because of lower playtimes, just to get superb skills again.

Gnua

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Re: Reincarnation
« Reply #31 on: June 28, 2019, 07:41:23 AM »
as for the legendary characters having to make a huge choice to scrap much of that progress and start fresh...couldnt that be a good thing?  i like the big decisions like that...

it could, that's why i asked what the intention of this change is.  is it to inflict a penalty on people who get legend asap?  Is it to delay legend? is it to give people something to do before legend?  If so, then maybe we should just get rid of legend or make it require rank 40.  As long as legendary is a thing, I will legend asap, but maybe legend was bad for the game.  before legend the clans co-operate with one another.  after legend, a clan barely cooperates with itself.
« Last Edit: June 28, 2019, 07:47:54 AM by gnua »

Malaki

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Re: Reincarnation
« Reply #32 on: June 28, 2019, 07:57:20 AM »
Interesting idea, seems to be trying to solve the symptom not the root cause / problem.  Overall i would say it would only create additional imbalance, and create a larger divide between those that grind time in the game and not.

If need more ease of ranks, bump rank xp or add more locations with it.
If need to reset spell failures, increase the availability or ability to do that.
If need more HP, add more HP gear, preps, ranks.

I think this helps identify areas for adjustment.

Certainly an interesting take on things.

raf

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Re: Reincarnation
« Reply #33 on: June 28, 2019, 08:44:25 AM »
As I understand the proposed system, the idea of losing all rank progress / legend skills and abilities of a character class is not viable, at least the style of play which revolves around doing high-end content. You can do this by rolling a separate new character.

A better design is the one that Rift MMO has where you could switch between roles (classes in effect).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rift_(video_game)#Gameplay

Basically you can switch at whim (out of combat) between roles (classes), and allow sharing of certain skills/spells that cross-over. This effectively removes the need to destroy your advanced character and you can choose to play/advance any one class and switch back and forth.
« Last Edit: June 28, 2019, 08:45:56 AM by raf »

Gnua

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Re: Reincarnation
« Reply #34 on: June 28, 2019, 09:25:01 AM »
As I understand the proposed system, the idea of losing all rank progress / legend skills and abilities of a character class is not viable, at least the style of play which revolves around doing high-end content. You can do this by rolling a separate new character.

Maybe the intent is to take the focus away from high-end content.  Those that focus on high-end content too early will eventually wind up behind those that who reincarnate often.  Those who want the most powerful character will have to delay legendary and let those who legendary early get ahead of them.  Those who go for an early lead will be far behind those who reincarnate 6x when the reincarnaters finally legend.  Maybe the reincarnaters will enter pickup groups when they meet people in sligs or brogs since they dont have the opportunity to group with their clannies.  Maybe pk will erupt over zonestealing deep mines.  If this is the way we are moving, perhaps we should just remove legendary and have reincarnation take its palce.

Dyl

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Re: Reincarnation
« Reply #35 on: June 28, 2019, 09:54:25 AM »
The coin sink to rebuy legend and legend ranks is absurd, to do it 7 times over is mad.

raf

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Re: Reincarnation
« Reply #36 on: June 28, 2019, 10:03:04 AM »
Those who want the most powerful character will have to delay legendary and let those who legendary early get ahead of them.  Those who go for an early lead will be far behind those who reincarnate 6x when the reincarnaters finally legend.

I'd like to see someone catching up to a 45+ rank wipe legendary character if you reincarnate 6x. Maybe Adepali can try this and see how much fun it is after 9 months being still rank 1.

Tajs

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Re: Reincarnation
« Reply #37 on: June 28, 2019, 11:08:38 AM »
Those who want the most powerful character will have to delay legendary and let those who legendary early get ahead of them.  Those who go for an early lead will be far behind those who reincarnate 6x when the reincarnaters finally legend.

I'd like to see someone catching up to a 45+ rank wipe legendary character if you reincarnate 6x. Maybe Adepali can try this and see how much fun it is after 9 months being still rank 1.

It's the bought ranks that are to be reset, as I understand it, not character back to rank 1

Kam

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Re: Reincarnation
« Reply #38 on: June 28, 2019, 12:37:40 PM »
There is no 'problem' that the reincarnation feature is intended to solve.

Reincarnation is simply a new facet that we are adding to the game.
It is optional and may not be for everyone, we understand that and are fine with it.

Kam

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Re: Reincarnation
« Reply #39 on: June 28, 2019, 01:14:45 PM »
A theoretical example of progression here:

 - You are level 30, 1X and rank 15 (out of 50).
   - You reincarnate, you are now level 1 and rank 17 (out of 52).
   - You reach level 30 and 1X again, say you're rank 24 (out of 52) now.
     - You reincarnate the second time, you are now level 1 and rank 26 (out of 54).
     - You reach level 30 and 1X again, say you're rank 34 (out of 54) now.
       - You reincarnate the third time, you are now level 1 and rank 36 (out of 56).
       - You reach level 30 and 1X again, say you're rank 42 (out of 56).
         - You reincarnate the fourth time, you are now level 1 and rank 44 (out of 58).
         - You reach level 30 and 1X again, say you're rank 50 (out of 58).
            - You reincarnate the fifth time, you are now level 1 and rank 52 (out of 60).
            - You reach level 30 and 1X again, say you're rank 56 (out of 60).
               - You reincarnate the sixth time, you are now level 1 and rank 58 (out of 62).
               - You can continue to level 30/1X/rank 62.

By now you've gained +12 points to your base stats (in increments of 2).
You have been able to change races six times.
You have +120 movement points.
You have +90/60/30 hitpoints class depending.
You have a permanent -6 saving spell bonus.
Each time you've reincarnated all your spell failures have been removed (this also happens each level and each rank gained, remember).
Each time your kill history (this is how you "max" on mobs) is reset.


The ranks you gain do not count toward the max, effectively raising the max rank by 2 each time you reincarnate.
The ranks you gain from reincarnation do not affect the amount of rankxp it takes to gain a new rank.
- This is maybe a little convoluted, but: if you're rank 20 and reincarnate you're now rank 22 but the rankxp required to reach rank 23 is the same as it would have been to reach rank 21 before you reincarnated.
You will lose any progress toward your next rank when you reincarnate. So if you are rank 10 and 54% to rank 11, when you reincarnate you'll be rank 12 and 0% to rank 13.
« Last Edit: June 28, 2019, 01:44:28 PM by Kam »

Gnua

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Re: Reincarnation
« Reply #40 on: June 28, 2019, 02:45:37 PM »
xp loss on death seems to be tied to the xp required to level.  after a few reincarnations and enough unlucky deaths, the kill history might get to the point where a player would not be able to reliably gain xp.

shardelay

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Re: Reincarnation
« Reply #41 on: June 28, 2019, 06:09:21 PM »
xp loss on death is confusing.  If i die at 1x on two characters (woops!) at the same time, they often require different amounts of XP to get to 1x again.

Mysterious!

Jorake

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Re: Reincarnation
« Reply #42 on: June 29, 2019, 08:23:45 AM »
I think Kam explained it well. And I'm on board. Is this a next wipe type thing?

Malthros

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Re: Reincarnation
« Reply #43 on: June 29, 2019, 10:55:13 AM »
xp loss on death seems to be tied to the xp required to level.  after a few reincarnations and enough unlucky deaths, the kill history might get to the point where a player would not be able to reliably gain xp.

Isn’t the kill list finite?  Someone who has reincarnated multiple times is probably going to be playing it safe while leveling and know enough zones, or be in a clan with people who know enough, that they won’t hit a dead end.

Plus i don’t think you can max out on quest xp, or did that change in recent years?


E: to be clear, I’m also ok with no xp penalty when reincarting because that’s going to be hell for neutrals unless it’s less than what good and evil aligns get.
« Last Edit: June 29, 2019, 10:57:03 AM by Malthros »

Kam

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Re: Reincarnation
« Reply #44 on: June 29, 2019, 02:15:54 PM »
It would be impossible to actually 'dead end' on XP. Learn more zones.