Author Topic: ruined wipes  (Read 9119 times)

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Khad

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ruined wipes
« on: June 03, 2016, 06:42:58 PM »
just what i said before, people will return to the game they played around  2001-2007. and i will. surely.
someone, help me argue this. alot of people missing some of lost things like fixed rank gain, and not so short, nearly stupid decay timers, etc.
assumed that last 2 wipes just inexistent. because of worse changes made.
ps. where the hell is remorhaz?
« Last Edit: June 03, 2016, 07:00:07 PM by Khad »

oom

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Re: ruined wipes
« Reply #1 on: June 04, 2016, 09:51:32 AM »
I don't see 2001-2007 as some magical time in ArcticMud history. Honestly I think the mud has gotten better and better as far as zoning/soloing/any non-pk gameplay is concerned.

I feel like this culminated when class specific sets were introduced. I think, other than pk, the game was about as good as it could get last wipe and the wipe previous. I feel like this is the wipe that people hated.

Group sized down to 8 then back to 10 but with massive character stat and save nerfs in between.

Everyone who rushed day one has a nerfed character for the whole wipe.

Stats, even after rebalance, total crap compared to previous wipes.

Items in general nerfed, weapons nerfed but also made completely boring.

Going in to the wipe we were told(or at least most assumed) that group sizes would be cut in half, and to make up for this characters would obviously be roughly twice as strong.

LOL ON US

The worst part in my mind is the complete lack of understanding most players have as to what is happening.

Why the nerfs? Who are they for? Which players are having more fun now?

Is the game a lot more challenging now? Not a ton more no... just not as exciting(for me).

I've played this game for like 20 years or whatever it's been. I still play because it's familiar to me. I consider Deep Mine to be a "new" zone still.

I welcome new content, I welcome most changes with an open mind, but when the items I've fallen in love with over the last couple of decades are turned into the same crap that you find in the solace weapon and armor shop I don't feel that excitement or familiarity. Loring things is NOT the fun activity it once was..

Give us back greenen back door and restore items to what they were 2 wipes ago.

Make ArcticMUD great again.

But hey, maybe I'm wrong and most people love the changes but are just silent about the topic. I am mostly a soloer or 3-4 man group leader so my experience may be different than others.

That said, I do appreciate that the game is still here and people care enough to run a server and make some updates. I do still play occasionally, and have played for probably 10 hours or so in the last week and a half.


Dyl

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Re: ruined wipes
« Reply #2 on: June 04, 2016, 09:57:35 AM »
Oom has some great points but he forgot to mention that hoss is a cunt

Kadaj

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Re: ruined wipes
« Reply #3 on: June 04, 2016, 02:17:38 PM »
Some of the changes are......strange, yes. I think what we need is a little more transparency. Why X is happening. Why Y is not happening. Just a quick NEWS would be somewhat helpful in knowing the direction the game is going.

Khad

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Re: ruined wipes
« Reply #4 on: June 04, 2016, 08:17:24 PM »
we all love the game that gone. developers, we want that game back, just roll back. do not fix what not broken. and why the hell many inns were removed? kadaj stated changes as "strange". he is too polite. i want the game i played for 15 years, not counting last 5 i didnt play. if you want to make your own game, make a couple of test servers, we try and tell you what we think about your "changes".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTSPyAiEhlg
« Last Edit: June 04, 2016, 08:52:59 PM by Khad »

Bmoc

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Re: ruined wipes
« Reply #5 on: June 04, 2016, 09:50:22 PM »
I agree with Oom and Khad.  The fact that many of us are still around after twenty years is a testament to the quality of the game.  I too feel that the new changes and direction are doing much more to hurt the game than improve game play.  Like many others, I'd come back if the game were rolled back to a previous version.

Kadaj

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Re: ruined wipes
« Reply #6 on: June 05, 2016, 09:28:13 PM »
This game is indeed timeless. I know a lot of you still playing, just like myself are feeling a little left in the dark. You have to realize that the immortals don't get paid to do this. They aren't part of a giant company trying to make the best decisions to make the highest profit. They do this in their free time and that's something a lot of us older gamers are lacking.  That being said, I think some of the more game changing decisions should perhaps be taken up by the community. What do we want to see happen with this game? What should the immortals focus on first. It seems like the imms have a lot of good ideas and try to implement them all at once instead of easing the mortals into the new direction the game is going, which leaves most of us in the dark on what is happening.  I know How's hates me, he's not a very good people person. But give him and the imms a break. They don't need to do shit, but they do. Sure we could be back to 15 years ago with the knowledge we have now....and be out of tons of new zones, new features and general quality of life changes.  So before you just shout out that this game sucks and it's their fault, just think of what they have done in the last 15 years that was good and hope more of that is coming in the grand view of things. 


On tablet, sorry for grammar.

Super Tacoman

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Re: ruined wipes
« Reply #7 on: June 06, 2016, 11:43:10 AM »
kadaj has a point.  the immortals have been keeping this game alive for free all these years.  thx again for that guys.

but now from their point of view they have put all this work into project lube and all of us already hate it and wont play it.  they havent even done all the nerfs yet!  so to them we seem ungrateful brats unwilling to give their project a chance.  now they just are saying "bapt em.  if they dont appreciate our work we will leave it like this and see how they like it".

and that is how arctic died.


Jang Yoo Sung

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Re: ruined wipes
« Reply #8 on: June 07, 2016, 08:46:12 AM »
what the imms have done i appreciate ofcourse
but why fix something that is not broken? that is a diff issue
why change something that non of the players like?
we appreciate what the imms have done for the game for the past years
and we would appreciate it even more if they would retain the current state that we loved for so many years
a roll back to the previous wipe status, i think everyone would be happy

again im not saying the imms suck or they are cunts or i dont appreciate what they're doing etc
im just saying, and i think most ppl would agree, that the game was just a whole lot better before the changes that's all
better stats, better eq would benefit everyone i think, after all we dont have as much time to put into this game as we did in high school or college
i would really appreciate it if we could have that previous wipe until the day i die...with some minor changes here and there in between just to spice things up maybe
but this current state...is just a step back not a step forward imo
if we cant go forward why dont we just stay at the current spot

i think i've stayed quiet enuf for the past few months to say a word or two

thank you ys out

btown

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Re: ruined wipes
« Reply #9 on: June 08, 2016, 05:08:03 PM »
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hZG-Ph3DUq4

A little off-topic but i this video you can relate to arctic about then and now from a youtuber who plays rust

jrrestad

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Re: ruined wipes
« Reply #10 on: June 09, 2016, 07:41:49 PM »
The new content added to this game IE ranks/legends/gear/zones has only contributed positively to the game.  Nerfs, typically only hurt the playerbase and should really be acceptable only on a small scale.

The Good:

Legendaries are awesome.  I don't understand anyone who whines about this 'breaking' the game.  I would quit a the game I've played for nearly 20years in a heartbeat if we went back to the mud 15years ago.

New zone content is great, keep it coming.  Not sure why Tantallon/phaethon was removed but I'm sure there was a reason.

Rank system and new ranks... Awesome, more the merrier. 

Strongholds need work, but they are better than nothing.  Big plus.

Healing Changes are not really a bad thing, its really a healing buff.  It might be rough at low levels, but you shouldn't be bringing a trash character to Cyan or Sleet so I chalk this up to an Arctic win.

Extra-attack and increased stat on some gear items is great!  Who doesn't love 3str 2con boots, or all these 4 stat items floating around! Keep it coming!

The Bad:

Casting level is a bit rough.  The idea, I believe, was to prevent trash mages.  The sheaf system didn't work and we're all glad that's no longer.  However the casting level approach, while implemented with good intentions, is a detriment.  Instead of requiring casting level to be able to land locates or relocate to non clanned/groupped the spells could work like an aggressive spell with a chance to fail.  Instead of casting level on all mage gear, spell damage/power could be added and overall mage strength reduced (not different from a 15cl mage).  Requiring a mage to be 28-30 cl is like requiring someone to have 28str to wield any kind of decent prime.  It's stupid.

Stat changes being reduced across the board is harsh.  This certainly places more emphasis on +stat gear but it really just places more of an emphasis on elite gear to be hoarded.

Reduction in legendary rank power was not needed.  Thieves used to get 2str now they get 1dex?  Nerfs bad, buffs good.

Rank 50 is not enough, John don't quuuuit!

The Ugly:

Weapon weights are terrible.  I like that some weapons require 28str, it's kind of neat that some huge weapons require high strength to wield but not all of them!  Perhaps a 2d10 2/2 and a 2d10 2/2 that has a nice spec but are both equally difficult to obtain should differ in their max strength required to wield.  A shaman requires 24str to wield any good weapon.  A barbarian requires 24 to wield any decent weapon, 28 for a good one.  Ever been weakened on a barbarian while wielding your 28str weapon?  Oh you want to switch dances?  Perhaps you should wield your prime that you are now too weak to wield.  Better carry some shop shortswords.

Weapon stats are frustrating, to say the least.  2d4, 2d5, 2d6, 2d7, 2d8, 2d10 yada ya...  I won't rant too much here as I'm trying to be patient and see if they get 'fixed'.  I understood these stats to be just a base for now, however....
Limit 1 weapons shouldn't be absolute trash.  If a sword of kings or a vicious mithril broadsword, both limit one, has base stats 2d6 2/2 they wouldn't be halfway decent if made 6d2 2/2.

Exotic race versus regular is just downright ugly.  There are only 3 races that exist in Arcticland and you guessed it: Dargonesti, gully dwarf, minotaur.  I can roll a 19 or 20str exotic, but only a 16-17 str regular?  Wait I need 24 - 28 str to wield best primes?  And I can only buy 4 str ranks?  And I don't get as much str from legend ranks or legend skills? 

The End:

Of my whining at least.

Two things I always like to advocate for are 1) more ranks, more spells, more damage, more power, more flexibility really.  I don't believe anyone who says that they are too powerful and are going to quit.  Yes people get bored and move on.  You didn't quit because you were too strong... which brings me to number 2) shorter wipes.  3-4 months seems ideal.  A simple player wipe would keep people from getting too bored.  Players would likely focus more on their characters or wipe goals knowing they don't have forever.  Anyone who still says 3-4 months isn't a long enough wipe needs to stop playing 8 different alts.

corey

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Re: ruined wipes
« Reply #11 on: June 10, 2016, 06:35:01 AM »
The new content added to this game IE ranks/legends/gear/zones has only contributed positively to the game.  Nerfs, typically only hurt the playerbase and should really be acceptable only on a small scale.

The Good:

Legendaries are awesome.  I don't understand anyone who whines about this 'breaking' the game.  I would quit a the game I've played for nearly 20years in a heartbeat if we went back to the mud 15years ago.

New zone content is great, keep it coming.  Not sure why Tantallon/phaethon was removed but I'm sure there was a reason.

Rank system and new ranks... Awesome, more the merrier. 

Strongholds need work, but they are better than nothing.  Big plus.

Healing Changes are not really a bad thing, its really a healing buff.  It might be rough at low levels, but you shouldn't be bringing a trash character to Cyan or Sleet so I chalk this up to an Arctic win.

Extra-attack and increased stat on some gear items is great!  Who doesn't love 3str 2con boots, or all these 4 stat items floating around! Keep it coming!

The Bad:

Casting level is a bit rough.  The idea, I believe, was to prevent trash mages.  The sheaf system didn't work and we're all glad that's no longer.  However the casting level approach, while implemented with good intentions, is a detriment.  Instead of requiring casting level to be able to land locates or relocate to non clanned/groupped the spells could work like an aggressive spell with a chance to fail.  Instead of casting level on all mage gear, spell damage/power could be added and overall mage strength reduced (not different from a 15cl mage).  Requiring a mage to be 28-30 cl is like requiring someone to have 28str to wield any kind of decent prime.  It's stupid.

Stat changes being reduced across the board is harsh.  This certainly places more emphasis on +stat gear but it really just places more of an emphasis on elite gear to be hoarded.

Reduction in legendary rank power was not needed.  Thieves used to get 2str now they get 1dex?  Nerfs bad, buffs good.

Rank 50 is not enough, John don't quuuuit!

The Ugly:

Weapon weights are terrible.  I like that some weapons require 28str, it's kind of neat that some huge weapons require high strength to wield but not all of them!  Perhaps a 2d10 2/2 and a 2d10 2/2 that has a nice spec but are both equally difficult to obtain should differ in their max strength required to wield.  A shaman requires 24str to wield any good weapon.  A barbarian requires 24 to wield any decent weapon, 28 for a good one.  Ever been weakened on a barbarian while wielding your 28str weapon?  Oh you want to switch dances?  Perhaps you should wield your prime that you are now too weak to wield.  Better carry some shop shortswords.

Weapon stats are frustrating, to say the least.  2d4, 2d5, 2d6, 2d7, 2d8, 2d10 yada ya...  I won't rant too much here as I'm trying to be patient and see if they get 'fixed'.  I understood these stats to be just a base for now, however....
Limit 1 weapons shouldn't be absolute trash.  If a sword of kings or a vicious mithril broadsword, both limit one, has base stats 2d6 2/2 they wouldn't be halfway decent if made 6d2 2/2.

Exotic race versus regular is just downright ugly.  There are only 3 races that exist in Arcticland and you guessed it: Dargonesti, gully dwarf, minotaur.  I can roll a 19 or 20str exotic, but only a 16-17 str regular?  Wait I need 24 - 28 str to wield best primes?  And I can only buy 4 str ranks?  And I don't get as much str from legend ranks or legend skills? 

The End:

Of my whining at least.

Two things I always like to advocate for are 1) more ranks, more spells, more damage, more power, more flexibility really.  I don't believe anyone who says that they are too powerful and are going to quit.  Yes people get bored and move on.  You didn't quit because you were too strong... which brings me to number 2) shorter wipes.  3-4 months seems ideal.  A simple player wipe would keep people from getting too bored.  Players would likely focus more on their characters or wipe goals knowing they don't have forever.  Anyone who still says 3-4 months isn't a long enough wipe needs to stop playing 8 different alts.

Bob and I quit because we were too strong

Gnua

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Re: ruined wipes
« Reply #12 on: June 10, 2016, 05:08:04 PM »
The Bad:
Casting level is a bit rough.
Weapon weights are terrible.
Exotic race versus regular is just downright ugly.

I'm pretty sure you can get playable cl by doing the lowbie mage book run for weapon, head, boots, pants, body about.  rings can come from the lowbie quest.  neck and wrist are a little harder and you might need to scum from world merchant or core clan floor.

i agree about weapon weights.  you need 24str for good stuff but 24 str when weakened means you cant dance so you are stuck with 3d8 double or 2d7 prime trash.

despite the stat difference, i find that my exotics are trash compared to my legend shaman. being high rank seems to be way more important the exotic.

Gramm

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Re: ruined wipes
« Reply #13 on: June 18, 2016, 11:08:08 AM »
the only really terrible change is weapons stats. terrible for everyone.
make the group size whatever who cares, lower player stats sure...
leave the weapons the way they were because this tiered system just makes me yawn. why not keep the weapons stats diverse and exciting?

the best changes you could honestly make to the mud would be reverting back to the weapons from last wipe and I honestly feel removing clans from the game in general would mix things up a bit in a good way.

Gnua

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Re: ruined wipes
« Reply #14 on: June 22, 2016, 09:54:03 AM »
I honestly feel removing clans from the game in general would mix things up a bit in a good way.

other muds have a 'friend' system.  dont know how hard that would be to implement though