Author Topic: Healing Cloud  (Read 14058 times)

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muddeer

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Re: Healing Cloud
« Reply #15 on: December 07, 2015, 06:53:10 PM »
Do you play naked characters when you play? All this does is add another element to the equation of how people gear their casters. More slots? More saves? More healing done? If anything I see an increase in options meaning more useful gear being spread out across a smaller population. Just like lower stats make certain plus stat gear more desirable so too will this have an affect on increasing the desirability of gear that might have previously been overlooked or deemed not great.

Maybe my post wasn't clear, but I think gear becoming more important is BAD, not good as you think.  It means more gap between casual and hardcore players.  It means bigger difference between small and big clans.  It means new players have even less chance of beating vets, regardless of how smart or creative he is, and have larger humps to get over to close that gap.

The player knowledge of gear loading zones you are talking about is just one of many types of knowledge that SHOULD determine success.  Knowledge of game mechanics, how to play a class properly, tricks in pk fights, good hiding and ambushing spots, creative ways to beat a big mob, etc...  All of these facets of the game, along with player skills like quick thinking and proper decision making, become less and less important as what equipment you are wearing becomes more important.

And how many players actually figure out zones to load gear for themselves?  Vast majority just learn it from others or, not even that, simply follow his clan around.  And making gear so important makes these players to be more "successful" than those who are actually better players.  It would be nice if players can spend more time learning the game, zones, and how to play better, rather than having to forced to chase decay after decay because YOU SUCK WITHOUT THAT GEAR.
« Last Edit: December 07, 2015, 07:15:06 PM by muddeer »

corey

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Re: Healing Cloud
« Reply #16 on: December 07, 2015, 07:03:11 PM »
Hoss - Good changes for the most part but I disagree with the druid one.

One person mentioned they'll be unreliable and that's completely fair to assume that - they will be.

Instead of making the proc chance 50%:

 - keep proc chance at 100%, reduce healing by 50%
 - keep proc chance at 100%, reduce healing by 75%, add 50% chance to go off twice, 20% chance to go off thrice

Beryv

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Re: Healing Cloud
« Reply #17 on: December 07, 2015, 07:14:47 PM »
Well muddeeerrr, I have to disagree. I think making more gear desirable adds parity to the game as opposed to increasing the disparity between the elite and the rest of the mud.

muddeer

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Re: Healing Cloud
« Reply #18 on: December 07, 2015, 07:25:15 PM »
Now if this cure change works like casting levels for mages, then it won't be bad.  There is a max to how many CL's you can have, and getting that max isn't difficult for even casual players.

But the fact that you can cure for 120 with a cure light suggests that there will be some rare gear with OP +heal%.  Wonder who will end up with those.  So, ya, this change will definitely will not bring parity "between the elite and the rest of the mud".

Even if it did, doesn't change my main discontent with the direction that Arctic is taking.  Gear dependence reduces importance of player skills and knowledge, and forces those of us who are not interested in being gear whores to become one, because most classes are now useless if not fully equipped.
« Last Edit: December 07, 2015, 07:55:46 PM by muddeer »

Alecto

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Re: Healing Cloud
« Reply #19 on: December 07, 2015, 08:04:49 PM »
I suspect that the motivating idea for the 36s is that players will have to make a CHOICE...more heals or higher heal%, load up on +wisdom or load up on +hp, etc.  There is a flip-side to this, of course, which I don't think many have explored - there are healing_received flags as well.  If access to both healing_done and healing_received are being increased in the game this could be a net gain for almost any player who is willing to experiment. 

However, I do agree that the inconsistency of healing cloud will now effectively take druids out of the "top 8" for the biggest fights in the game.  Clerics are back, baby!

See everyone Saturday!

p.s. How is the efficacy of heal potions impacted by this change?  The idea that I might need EVEN more heal pots for the Rose quest fight is a little daunting...

Morte

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Re: Healing Cloud
« Reply #20 on: December 07, 2015, 10:01:12 PM »
mass r.i.p. in some zones is going to be gg until everyone has backup gear and characters.

snax

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Re: Healing Cloud
« Reply #21 on: December 07, 2015, 10:53:35 PM »

However, I do agree that the inconsistency of healing cloud will now effectively take druids out of the "top 8" for the biggest fights in the game.  Clerics are back, baby!

See everyone Saturday!

p.s. How is the efficacy of heal potions impacted by this change?  The idea that I might need EVEN more heal pots for the Rose quest fight is a little daunting...

Legend entangle and areas are enough to give a druid one of the top 8 group slots.  Stun is how an 8v8 is won, and legend entangle still remains pretty much one of the most deadly forms with nightmare's super nerf, the proposed blastwave corrections, and the sketchiness of prismatic....and yeah I won't even comment on how unreliable the cleric holy waste of 2 rounds mass stun spell is.


Kadaj

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Re: Healing Cloud
« Reply #22 on: December 08, 2015, 05:12:21 AM »
The overall changes are exactly what this game needed as far as a cleric POV. Having to actively select which cure to use at the current time and on who will make playing a healer more of a skill match up rather than X is at v.bad, press alias to heal X.  The actions taken during a fight is going to be awesome compared to simply just healing. The druid change I'm not sure about. Having one of their 8th circle spells be completely RNG is bad. I agree with most posts here that the proc should be 100% but the healing amount, 25, 50, 75, 100 be dependant on their +healing/healing factor.  Good changes, excited about the wipe for sure!

Gnua

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Re: Healing Cloud
« Reply #23 on: December 08, 2015, 09:35:29 AM »
Do you play naked characters when you play?

You mean apart from doing a CR? Some of us do. Main tanks sometimes have a trash healer and vice versa.  Sometimes it is the legend that is naked and the alt that is geared. Though if more +stat/+healing gear starts loading in zones that load things like forcebolt and cloak of bravery, it might encourage some of the trash/alts to put on some clothes and the mains to make some choices. I dont like putting clan gear on an alt.

Beryv

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Re: Healing Cloud
« Reply #24 on: December 08, 2015, 09:45:57 AM »
Even better if this means somebody won't roll that 4th or 5th alt because they have nothing better to do and won't be able to equip it/coin it properly to maintain gear. Personally I would increase rents on gear across the board and even more so on elite items to avoid storage/deep renting.

jrrestad

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Re: Healing Cloud
« Reply #25 on: December 08, 2015, 10:07:13 AM »
These changes suck.  Arctic was already too gear dependent, and it's getting worse and worse every wipe.  People are afraid to lose their shinies, so don't fight and hoard their good stuff on storages.  We need a game that's more player-skill and knowledge dependent, not on which clan you belong to or who your friends are.

Arctic is now just a competition to see who gets the best gear.  No wonder everyone wipe-day rush now days and then the mud is dead rest of the wipe;  all wants to grab the shinies, declare themselves the winner and deep rent.  Why keep playing?  To chase decays?

I think you're looking at this the wrong way.  You think these changes will help the elite player and hinder the average one. 

Take, for example, the class set items.  The set bonuses are very good, and yes you have to work a little to achieve the full set.  However, these pieces offer the average player something that's achievable.  Whereas when I load a class specific set piece I usually drop it or sell it.

I believe this change is, initially, a nerf across the board.  Then, once you play your character and load a few pieces of gear you can play at a competitive level.  Hopefully this change will make clerics/shamans a more viable class to play, instead of logging my legendary trash cleric to heal a zone when no one else is around.

Super Tacoman

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Re: Healing Cloud
« Reply #26 on: December 08, 2015, 01:13:58 PM »
the result of casting level getting put in the game for me was that i never played a mage again.  i didnt want to have to worry about my gear all the time.  now they are basically moving toward every class needing casting level.  i dont think i will like this new game arctic is turning into.

eddiex

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Re: Healing Cloud
« Reply #27 on: December 08, 2015, 01:17:02 PM »
I disagree with the idea the Proc should land 100% of the time.  It seems like ideas (particularly ones that would like the cloud to be able to do 100% of its capability in previous wipes) basically want equipped druids to remain unchanged.  How can people justify a legendary character that is extremely hard-bash(even harder when sitting bash and damn near no bash with very few bash mod items) which is able to heal it self 300 hp a round for 7 rounds.  Does this not make them virtually unkillable?  If it capped at 150-200 hp a round (total split between the 2 procs) that may be more reasonable, but even then you are giving solo druids a 150-200hp lim dam a round (and all they have to do is cast a stone skin while cloud is up to return right back to full health, Guaranteed).

Druids existed before healing cloud.  Currently, they have arguably the strongest direct damage frag in the game.  They can make their group hit like maniacs with primal fury. They have the most effective control spell in the game in legend entangle. And can negate almost all melee damage with stone skin for a number of hits/rounds.  Druids remaining able to also heal themselves (while solo for 300 hp a round) or brainlessly group heal is unacceptable.

Healing cloud still remains in the game and can be used to help with group healing.  You just cannot guarantee it saving your ass as a primary option. 
« Last Edit: December 08, 2015, 01:21:59 PM by eddiex »

Gnua

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Re: Healing Cloud
« Reply #28 on: December 08, 2015, 02:47:25 PM »
the result of casting level getting put in the game for me was that i never played a mage again.  i didnt want to have to worry about my gear all the time.  now they are basically moving toward every class needing casting level.  i dont think i will like this new game arctic is turning into.

Perhaps the problem is that your main looks too much like the "trash-alts" of more dedicated players. An earlier post made it sound like Beryv wanted to discourage people from rolling alts by making it both difficult and necessary to coin/gear them. Unless there is a good way to separate trash-alts from casual-mains, then changes to discourage one will also discourage the other.

I think many people stopped playing trash mages after CL came in. I think this was and still is considered a good thing. The same reasoning could be applied to other caster classes. I stopped playing clerics and switched to Shaman when Shesh pointed out that you have to gear them (+heals) and spell them.
« Last Edit: December 08, 2015, 02:49:42 PM by gnua »

corey

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Re: Healing Cloud
« Reply #29 on: December 08, 2015, 06:19:52 PM »
I disagree with the idea the Proc should land 100% of the time.  It seems like ideas (particularly ones that would like the cloud to be able to do 100% of its capability in previous wipes) basically want equipped druids to remain unchanged.  How can people justify a legendary character that is extremely hard-bash(even harder when sitting bash and damn near no bash with very few bash mod items) which is able to heal it self 300 hp a round for 7 rounds.  Does this not make them virtually unkillable?  If it capped at 150-200 hp a round (total split between the 2 procs) that may be more reasonable, but even then you are giving solo druids a 150-200hp lim dam a round (and all they have to do is cast a stone skin while cloud is up to return right back to full health, Guaranteed).

Druids existed before healing cloud.  Currently, they have arguably the strongest direct damage frag in the game.  They can make their group hit like maniacs with primal fury. They have the most effective control spell in the game in legend entangle. And can negate almost all melee damage with stone skin for a number of hits/rounds.  Druids remaining able to also heal themselves (while solo for 300 hp a round) or brainlessly group heal is unacceptable.

Healing cloud still remains in the game and can be used to help with group healing.  You just cannot guarantee it saving your ass as a primary option.

Keep in mind druids were refreshing machines before healing cloud